Special Withdrawals vs. Special Expenditures
I am adding a sunroom to my home this year. Is that a special withdrawal or a special expenditure or both? The special expenditure to detail the expense and the special withdrawal to pay for it?
I am adding a sunroom to my home this year. Is that a special withdrawal or a special expenditure or both? The special expenditure to detail the expense and the special withdrawal to pay for it?
View our range of other financial planning products powered by the Economic Security Computation Engine
Disclaimer: The suggestions and recommendations provided by Economic Security Planning, Inc.'s software tools and planning services do not constitute financial or investment advice. The creators of Economic Security Planning's software are not certified, registered, authorized, or any other form of financial planners. Economic Security Planning, Inc. is not an investment adviser registered with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission or any state securities agency, is not a registered broker-dealer and maintains no other regulatory credentials associated with the management of financial assets. Economic Security Planning, Inc. does not guarantee that the suggestions and recommendations derived from its software tools and planning services will necessarily achieve a secure economic plan. Like any software products, Economic Security Planning, Inc.'s software tools may have errors in its underlying code, and the assumptions about the future that it makes and that users input may prove false. In addition, output from the software tools and planning services may incorporate data obtained from third parties and such data (including any calculations that is based on such data) is provided on an “as is” basis. From time to time the output may contain errors that may be based upon, among other things, human data entry, aggregation and decompilation of data, processing of data through third party calculation engines and other processes that can give rise to errors. The company's financial plans and recommendations, including all of such plans and recommendations provided by its direct planning services, should be viewed as suggestive and informative educational inputs into your financial decision-making. None of our products or services recommend the purchase of specific financial products.
Copyright © 2023, ESPlanner || Patent Number: US 6611807 B1
Design by Zymphonies
Comments
BrianVezza
Mon, 08/29/2016 - 12:50
Permalink
There may not be a need to
There may not be a need to specify the expense either way as it's happening in 2016.
If this is a "large enough" amount, then include it as a special expenditure since this is guaranteed spending over normal consumption.
If you need to withdraw assets from retirement accounts to cover spending for a given year, then use special withdrawals.
You basically have it right, but you may not require a special withdrawal if the spending can come out of "normal" consumption.
Best,
Brian
terterazzo
Mon, 08/29/2016 - 14:34
Permalink
Thanks Brian. I can't cover
Thanks Brian. I can't cover the cost from normal consumption. It is a special expenditure in that sense. My main concern is how to best pay for it. The monies must come out of my retirement assets since I'm retired. The tricky part is balancing the tax hit for a large expenditure. Then it seems that I should both enter a special expense and a special withdrawal. Thoughts?
ChrisCowles
Mon, 08/29/2016 - 23:38
Permalink
"... The monies must come out
"... The monies must come out of my retirement assets since I'm retired. The tricky part is balancing the tax hit for a large expenditure. Then it seems that I should both enter a special expense and a special withdrawal. ..."
I agree with that approach but beware that a special withdrawal is a substitute, not a supplement, for a smooth withdrawal. So, the amount you record should be the total withdrawal for the year. Future years will be necessarily lower since there will be less available to withdraw evenly over time.
BrianVezza
Mon, 08/29/2016 - 18:39
Permalink
Sounds like you have this
Sounds like you have this right. You may decide to take withdrawals up to a certain amount out of tax-sheltered accounts (perhaps to the next tax bracket) and the rest from savings or Roth or alternatives, if you have them, or you could stagger this over two years (2016-17). By experimenting here you may find a benefit increasing your lifetime consumption / standard of living.
Best,
Brian
terterazzo
Tue, 08/30/2016 - 13:43
Permalink
Many thanks to Brian and
Many thanks to Brian and Chris! I really appreciate the help on this. Terry Finazzo
terterazzo
Wed, 08/31/2016 - 20:35
Permalink
Chris, thanks for the warning
Chris, thanks for the warning re the special withdrawal/smooth withdrawal! It is as you say...
ChrisCowles
Thu, 09/01/2016 - 01:08
Permalink
If you're using this to
If you're using this to decide if/when to make the withdrawals, watch the taxable income column in the income tax report. Compare that to thresholds for marginal tax brackets to see if your actions cause you to pay tax at a higher rate.
Alternatively, you may be able to manipulate your income down below the next lower rate, in certain years, while not causing other years to break into a higher bracket.
terterazzo
Fri, 09/02/2016 - 16:33
Permalink
Yes good point. Since I want
Yes good point. Since I want to pay for 1/2 of the sunroom from my savings and 1/2 from my Rollover IRA, I can vary the withdrawal amounts from the two to account for the tax issues somewhat. Kinda messy though...
BrianVezza
Mon, 09/05/2016 - 12:05
Permalink
It can get messy, but it can
It can get messy, but it can also make a real difference to your living standard to experiment with this. In one of the optimization challenges I mentioned, there was a 10+% improvement in standard of living for life and this was for a decent strategy to start with.
This specific area may only be ~1% or less (just a guess), but a more systematic optimization effort including Social Security claiming strategies can definitely be worth the effort.
Personally, I think profile optimization is the #1 biggest opportunity for most people. I've spent thousands of hours doing this and testing every strategy that I can think of along with doing sensitivity testing on these.
Hope this is helpful.
Best,
Brian
ChrisCowles
Fri, 09/02/2016 - 23:39
Permalink
Money is fungible. Take it
Money is fungible. Take it from where results in the highest LSPA after you spend it.
If debt isn't anathema to you, consider borrowing if that preserves invested assets at a higher rate of return than the cost of the loan. Debt involves risk and you're essentially investing on margin, but that's an investment philosophy issue.
If debt is an acceptable option, test the benefits by adding a loan to home it affects. That's different than allowed debt because it's a fixed payment and term. In contrast, allowed debt is basically a line of credit.
You could also borrow some and spend some cash out of one or more accounts.